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Len: Welcome back to
another edition of the Unofficial Guide Disney Dish Podcast with Jim Hill. It's
Len Testa, your host and today Jim and I have a treat for you. We're recording
live from Serenity Bay , the Adult Beach of Disney's Cast Away Cay. I gotta
tell you, is one of the best locations, Jim, we have ever recorded,
Jim: Dear Lord.
Len: We're at the far end of the Adult Beach, the water...
it's about eighty-five degrees outside, maybe eighty-four. The water is crystal
clear. The nearest people are probably a hundred yards from us. We can see all
the way down the ocean. There's islands in the distance. It's just beautiful
where we're at. So Jim, thanks for being here with us.
Jim: Oh, God. Thank you. This has been a treat. I mean, just
to get here... And I guess to... what's so ironic is we are here at this so
peaceful so mellow a surrounding and this only exists because Michael Eisner
was so insanely competitive. Just,
Len: That is absolutely fine.
Jim: You know, but it's just. I mean, to get to... How
Disney got into the cruise business... They never really meant to be in this
J: Well no, it was one of these things where Premier Cruise
Line which had, you know, everybody else
had... thought of cruising as kind of an older thing. And Premier bought
a bunch of boats and decided "Okay, the niche to go after is families." So they
were the big red boat.
Len: I remember this, okay (???).
Jim: And the whole notion of "Well, if we're going to do
family stuff, why don't we try to bundle a couple days in the Caribbean with a
couple days at Walt Disney World?" And Disney- and this is before Eisner walks
in the door. This is Eighty Three or thereabouts. Frankly, they're in a
financial position because of all the spending on Epcot and they're having to
spend their own money to build Tokyo cause they blown through that (???). So
it's like, this comes through the door and it's like "Absolutely, sure. You
want to license the rights of the official cruise line of Walt Disney World. Go
right ahead." But now Eight Three becomes Eighty Four, Ron Miller is out,
Michael Eisner is in. And just like Michael did with everything, it's like,
"Okay, excuse me, who, what is that thing up the road there, Busch Gardens?"
And it's like, "People are going there. Nanana. No, we need our own zoo."
Len: We need our own zoo.
Jim: You know, Animal Kingdom. And "What is this Church
Street Station thing where they go to at night?" It's like "Nanana, no. We need
one of our own." So we got a Pleasure Island. And over time Michael eventually
turned his eyes on Premiere. And it's one of these things where it's like, "Let
me get this straight. We have all these people who then get on a bus, go over
to Port Canaveral get on a cruise line... We don't get any of that?"
Len: We don't get any of the (???) spending of that?
Jim: You know it's like "Come on!" So, nine years in there
was an announcement that Premier and Disney were going to separate,
Len: Nine years in, so this is what, the,
Jim: This would have been, I want to say Ninety Two or
Len: Ninety Two, okay.
Jim: Yeah. And Disney then... Well, Premier turns around and
is like "Okay, well, it's not..." They still have the rights to sell vacation
packages. They're just not the official cruise line. They figure that, you
know, one of the perks was that they did have the Disney characters on their
Len: Really? Oh.
Jim: Yeah. So.
Len: That was probably big back then.
Jim: It was, it was. And but they turned around like, "Oh,
people aren't gonna notice. Let's get Bugs Bunny." And it's like, EEERRRNG. By
the year Two Thousand they were out of the business.
Jim: Oh yeah. Disney came... once Disney came online with
it's own cruise line, Premier just never recovered. They limped along for the
next couple of years. But it just never went where it was supposed to go.
Len: Wow. So when Disney signed this deal with Premier,
somewhere like the early to mid-Eighties to like Ninety-Two,
Len: Where there any Disney executives doing anything in the
cruise business or was it all run by Premiere?
Jim: It was all Premier. Though not to say that Disney
didn't look at doing stuff with boats but. Oh God, there's this amazing story
about Jim Cora, the guy in charge of International at Disney. And he's at
dinner one night and he's sitting next to a rear admiral from the American Navy
and the guy leans over and it's like, "You know, we got some extra aircraft carriers."
Len: "You guys should do something."
Jim: Yeah! "I got a few, if you want to actually... Wouldn't
it be cool if you build a theme park that you could float around the world."
And the guy's joking.
Jim: And is just "Hahaha." And Cora's like "Hmm..." And
Monday he goes into work,
Len: "Hand me a napkin, son!"
Len: "I must make some sketches."
Jim: But Monday, goes into work and begins asking around at
Imagineering, "Is there anybody who knows anything about boat building?" And
sure enough, there's an imagineer whose been with the company for eleven years
and has all sorts of navy history and he and Cora put together this plan of...
they're gonna find a super tanker,
Len: A super tanker.
Jim: A super tanker.
Jim: And then basically this is the SS Disney. And on four
separate floors of this thing- you know, the top floor, for example, where the,
if you know the standard super tanker set up, where the bridge is to the back
of the ship,
Jim: That was gonna be Small World.
Jim: But the thing is, where the captain looked out was
gonna be like up in the Eiffel Tower, all right. And below on the deck,
Len: So it's a boat ride on a boat.
Jim: Well that was the, actually, that's interesting that
you bring it up because I was talking with the guy about this and it's like,
"Well no, we couldn't do water and water." So it was gonna be, they were gonna
change Small World to an Omnimover. But they were gonna have this... And what's
interesting is it's sort of colors where... Based on the rides around this
thing, you know exactly when the history of the company is. They've got the
Indiana Jones cheap ride inside of this thing, they've got an Aladdin ride
through... they've got... but it's Tea Cups, it's the whole shmere and the
whole notion was that this thing would travel around the globe and go to all
the places that Disney couldn't go to.
Len: Coastal cities.
Jim: Yeah. And it's the whole notion of- go there for a
three month run. They'd have a drew of about five hundred permanent people that
were on this thing. They'd then hire fifteen hundred to two thousand locals
that would go through about two weeks of training. But it was designed that it
would basically do two.. I wanna say, eight hour days. Maybe six hour days
depending on the port. But ten thousand people allowed on the boat at one time.
Len: Wow. That's a lot of people.
Jim: It is a lot of people. But,
Len: That's super thick (???).
Jim: Yeah, but that's it exactly. And you've got fifteen
attractions on board. And,
Len: That's more than DCA opened with.
Jim: That's, this is the thing. And this got very very very
far along in the development phase. In fact, seriously folks, if you Google SS
Disney there's an article about this that will come up on the Disney and More
website that actually includes the white foam model with the exploded view so
you can go down all four decks and see all this stuff.
Jim: The guy who worked on this was very proud and he was
ultimately very frustrated because what happened was that it finally got to...
There's a very powerful wing of the Walt Disney Company that Iger basically
shut down when he came on board but it was the business development unit.
Inside the house it was called the business prevention unit because they said
no to many things. And both Wells and Eisner loved this idea and it's like "Oh
my God, we can go all these places where it doesn't make sense to build a
Disney theme park, but to have it there just for three months." They'd make
money hand over fist.
Len: Yeah. You can go to Seattle, you can go to all the port
Jim: That's it exactly. And in the end it was like, "No, it
makes more sense for us to go into the traditional cruise market."
Len: Which is not typically a bad idea.
Jim: No, no.
Len: In hindsight, but I get how, when the decision comes
down and whatever, it's like oh damn.
Jim: But at the same time, they're... you know, it seems
like a no brainer. Now as successful as it was. But at the same time, when it
was... oh boy. When they were trying to decide, it's like, "Okay, if we're
going into the cruise line business, what does the Disney Cruise Line look
like?" And you know, Joe Lanzisero shared a couple of early iterations where
for example there was one version where they had giant mouse ears on the
funnels and there was one where the notion of "Well why go to a far off
Caribbean island when we can make it a floating Caribbean island?" So it's
covered with palm trees and all these iterations,
Len: You mean like make one of the ship?
Jim: Yes! The notion is that you came onto the ship and it's
a floating island.
Len: A floating island. Got it, got it.
Jim: But in the end, Eisner's like, "No. It's cruising. It's
gotta be romantic. It's gonna be the sort of thing... you know, elegant." And
so everyone would walk up, just walk up to the edge of the (???). "You mean
like the Titanic?"
Len: It's like, the great steamships of yore. Without
Jim: Like the Andrea Doria.
Len: You know like the, I mean, like the, like the, (???)
Jim: And the other thing frankly, is,
Len: No sea story ever ends well. Have you noticed that?
There's nothing like, you know, we go in the boat in South Hampton and we
arrived in New York two weeks later. Everything was lovely.
Jim: There you go.
Len: That's just not
a good seafaring story.
Jim: No, it's not. It's not. And that coupled with the fact
that of course Disney doing (???) diligence went out and looked at all the
other cruise lines that were out there and it's like, you know, the phrase they
came back with is like "God, they're all floating milk cartons." These just big
Jim: You know, white, out wandering out in the ocean. It's
just, we don't want that. And so we want the lines (??) of the Thirties. We
want that sense of travel so it's like, "Okay. Are we going to do this? Okay.
We're gonna do this." And they began looking around,
Len: What year is this?
Jim: This is Ninety-Four.
Jim: They make the big announcement and they sign with an
Italian shipyard which, I think we should probably leave the name of the
Italian shipyard out because frankly, you can find this out by yourself folks
but this is where the story gets kind of interesting. Because they were the
ones who built all of the big boats for all of the cruise lines and as Disney
was entering the field, a lot of other people were ramping up. And Royal
Caribbean and the Nieuw Amsterdam folks and lots and lots of people were getting
into the cruise business in a big way and suddenly this shipyard had orders for
nine giant ships including the two Disney ships.
Len: What's typical for a shipyard? Like two?
Jim: Oh God. You're lucky if, cause again, these things take
eighteen months to build.
Len: Yeah. And they take a lot of steel. I mean, there are
actually people... People wait for dips in the steel market to commission the
Jim: Absolutely, absolutely. You know, when you're working
the financials of something... I mean, when Disney started out, the, in fact,
we were talking about this the other day cause it's fascinating. There's one
number they talk about when they started working on this. The first, when they
commissioned the Magic and the Wonder, they were two hundred and fifty million
dollars a piece.
Len: Okay, yeah.
Jim: All right. So for half a billion dollars they got two
ships. By the time these boats made it out into the water, the number Disney
was comfortable with talking about was seven.
Len: Wow. So seven total. So,
Len: So from two fifty to three fifty each.
Jim: Yeah. And a lot of that simply was because the level of
the Italian gentlemen who were building the ship were using the methods that
they always use to build ships. In fact, so Disney would go over and it's like
"So can I see your spreadsheet as to where the project is completion wise?" And
it's like, "Spreadsheet. What spreadsheet? What is this spreadsheet that you
Len: "What is the Italian equivalent of graph paper on a
Jim: And that coupled with, it's like, "We're kind of under
the gun here. We'll announce when we're launching..." And it's like, "You know,
we don't work holidays."
Len: We've been building ships for two thousand years.
Jim: Yeah so,
Len: It'll get done.
Jim: It'll get done. And what ended up happening is Disney
wound up having to cancel the first fifteen sailings of the Magic.
Jim: Yeah. I mean, And after- you gotta understand,
Len: So fifteen... the average is four or five days, so.
Wow, so they were two and a half, three months late.
Jim: Yeah. And that coupled with what ended up biting them
really in the butt was that they had made a big deal the summer before. I mean,
this is the first time is in Ninety-Eight. Ninety-Seven they actually announce
that you can enter a lottery to be on the first cruise.
Len: Oh wow.
Jim: And people had to put down a two hundred dollar deposit
to enter the lottery. And great fanfare, it's like "Oh we have, you won! And
these are your dates!" And then have to call back like six weeks later, "Uh,"
Len: "Funny story."
Len: "You know how the Italians are, right? In Italy."
Jim: And they were doing things like, "If you can change
your sailing, we'll give you a twenty percent discount."
Jim: But yeah, again, it wasn't an easy process to get into
this market. But at the same time, and again, it's kind of ironic because when
you think about the way people talked about how Disney Island was going to fail
or the first feature length cartoon was going to fail and so on and so forth.
The people who were watching Disney get into this business and build kid
friendly boats it's like, "Oh my God, you're insane." You know, the notion of
you gotta make the rooms literally twenty-five percent wider." Well, there goes
your margin. I mean, you just, you know. They're supposed to be small little
tight rooms. Or, one of the ideas that really differentiates Disney from the
rest of the cruises is the rotational dining. The, how many-
Len: Those are invention (??), yeah.
Jim: How many dining rooms are you going to make? And it's
like, "No, that's cabin space." And you sort stood outside and it's like, "This
makes no sense." And to carve out so much space in the middle of the boat for a
live theater show,
Len: Yeah, with the movie theater and a live theater.
Len: On every ship.
Jim: Yeah. And I won't say that it was immediately a hit out
of the box. There were a couple of hurricanes.
Jim: Not to mention a Norwalk (???) virus thing, where,
Len: Oh yeah. Yeah. The Norwalk Virus? Yeah.
Jim: Yeah, they went out in Ninety-Eight and they had one
cruise where a hundred and fifty people got sick. Mostly crew. So they brought
it in and did a quick cleaning and sent it out and then two hundred and fifty
people got sick. And they had to pull it. Around the holidays they had to shut
the ship down and here's poor Jay Rasulo out there like, "We're gonna clean the
boat, it's gonna be fine." But again, another thing of calling thousands of
people and saying "Your plan for a holiday vacation isn't going to happen this
year." But yeah, they eventually, in
fact, what's funny about that is immediately after that, ten days after they
cleaned the boat, who gets on the boat but former President Bush. And we're not
talking W, we're talking his dad.
Jim: Along with the Governor of Florida and their families.
Len: Oh Lord.
Jim: And it's one of these things where it's like, "Okay,
who called in what favor to the effect of "Our boat is safe, nobody is getting
sick." Even W's two daughters went down and did the trip with them.
Jim: Yep. And the Secret Service was just sort of like
"Don't interact with the general cruise members." Over our dead bodies. But
yeah it was an interesting couple of years. And suddenly Disney has this boat
that has ninety percent occupancy.
Len: So what itineraries are they choosing at this point? Is
it just strictly Caribbean?
Jim: Well, we were talking about this earlier cause
obviously with the two new boats and putting the Dream and the Fantasy on the
runs of various lengths around the Caribbean, they took what they now refer to
as the Classic Boats and one of them was originally stationed in Los Angeles
doing cruises to nowhere that didn't quite work out. And, in fact, you did the
one out of Galveston didn't you?
Len: I did Galveston, seven day Western Caribbean on the
Magic. And Galveston hadn't worked out as a port. So originally they were just
going to Port Canaveral right?
Jim: Yep, yep.
Len: so what made them decide to the other Ports? Was it
just to test demand?
Jim: Well, again. Iger likes to think of these boats as
ambassadors. And the notion is you move them to places where we aren't yet. In
fact, what's interesting when you talk with Iger about the cruise line is it's
like, "Look, we're not a company that has a cruise line. We're an entertainment
company that cruises." That's the thing of- we're constantly working to make
sure you're entertained within an inch of your life. In fact, we were just
talking about this the other night that I think what fascinates me about the
cruise line is when you get right down to it, when you get down to the level of
detail, the level of attentiveness, the quality of the experience, this is the
Walt Disney Company we used to find at the theme parks. Before they got so big.
Len: Everything is taken care of all the time. The staff to
passenger ratio on the cruise line is,
Jim: It's insane!
Len: It's like one staff for every three guests?
Jim: Yeah. Again, for example, on the, what is it, on the
Dream, the full boat, (???) that's thirty six hundred people on it. They're...
at full load it's four thousand. But there are fifteen hundred crew members.
And so when you work the math there, just it's one for every three point
Len: Two (???), yeah.
Jim: And it's one of these things where it sometimes can get
a little overwhelming. We were at dinner last night at the Royal Palace and it
was like every three seconds someone was coming by the table and introducing
Len: Ivan and Craig and,
Jim: Yeah! And it was just like, "Okay. Thank you."
Len: "And you do what, again?" Have you met your stateroom
Jim: Oh yes, yes. He's... "Mr. Jim!"
Len: I think I've seen the state attendant more than I've
seen my mother. But they're great. I mean, they're all... They work like dogs.
All of them.
Jim: They do. They do.
Len: I think they average like sixteen hour days. It's
Jim: Now, but again, if you want to feel pampered, if you
want to feel cared for, Cruise Line is the way to go.
Len: So Disney comes out, right, and immediately... what
were the rates? Like, I'm sure, like now they're rates are anywhere from
twenty-five to a hundred percent more than like Royal Caribbean for the same
cruise. So they're definitely charging a premium on a lot of things.
Jim: They are.
Len: The Mediterranean cruises, not so much. But the
Caribbean, the Alaska cruises, all those basic cruises Disney's charging a
premium for those. Did they originally start that way or was,
Jim: Well, no, they were... The numbers I've seen suggest
they were anywhere from a fifth more expensive to- and it was interesting to
watch them creep up. That,
Len: People still on the boat. Five percent. Yay people
still on the boat! Five percent.
Jim: Yeah. But it's, but at the same time it's frustrating
for Disney cause it's like, they will do things like the LA cruise,
Jim: And what they discovered is that when you go to a place
like LA and uh... I mean, face it, there's a lot of people cruising on this
boat that are piling on a Walt Disney World vacation.
Len: Oh yeah. Virtually everyone we've talked to, yeah.
Jim: Yep. And so it's an easy add on or it's an easy "Hey
you've done Disney World before, why don't you do this instead?" Where in LA,
the notion of "Well, why don't you bundle a cruise with a visit to the
Disneyland Resort." That's just not happening the way they'd hoped.
Jim: It's kind of a... you know, face it, Disneyland and...
I know this is going to upset a lot of people, but let's be honest here.
Disneyland is the world's most famous regional theme park. You know, when
you're getting seventy percent of your guests from less than a hundred miles
away and it's thirty percent that are
Jim: It's hard to then turn to that thirty percent and go
"Hey! You wanna go on a cruise!" There's... but they believe, give them five to
ten years, and give them the opportunity to do the Third Gate and then, and
Len: It becomes the destination.
Jim: It becomes the destination. But its Third Gate Water
Park, another hotel, I mean, there's... you're... two billion in the ground
before you can then turn around and say "Hey! And you want to go on a cruise!"
Len: And the ships aren't getting any cheaper now.
Jim: No, and in fact we, again we were just talking about
that. Now remember, we talked two fifty to three fifty.
Len: Three Fifty.
Jim: For the Magic and the Wonder. By the time it came to
build the Dream and the Fantasy- well, first of all, it's like, "Thank you nice
Italian ship builders, but we won't be coming back." They found a German firm
Meyer... I'm blanking.
Len: Meyer Werft.
Jim: Meyer Werft.
Jim: Who... they, and what was interesting in just the ten
years or so since they've been doing the new ships... The construction
technique had changed. For example with the... What they did with the two new
ships was almost like Legos. I mean, they broke the ship down into eighteen
different blocks and then would build each of the blocks and then put them
Len: Whereas the Italians were like rolling the keel, we're
building up the,
Jim: Yeah. It was very very traditional and that, to be
honest, that also ran over... one of the reasons they ran over. I mean, that
coupled with the fact that in the Italians' case it was just like "Look,
there's a ship ahead to you. And we're behind schedule. So we're going to pull
our people off of the Disney boat and put them on that one." It's like, "WHAT?"
So not happy with that. But the German... Actually, what's fascinating about
that is that these two cruise liners were built indoors.
Jim: Yeah. I mean, giant, giant, tremendously huge ship
building facility. In fact, they assembled all the steel and when the keel and
when it was water tight they flooded the building and floated the thing out of
Len: Wow that's cool.
Jim: Oh it's huge. Huge. And the nice thing is cause it took
eighteen months to build this thing, they kept it indoors and avoided two
German winters but the funny thing is that for the sea trial they got into,
they were out sort of testing everything and they got a freak winter snowstorm
and Joe has these great pictures of the deck of the ship covered with ice and
Len: Really? Like something out of uh, what's the crab show
Jim: Oh yeah! The,
Len: Deadliest Catch.
Jim: Deadliest Catch. And it was just, that was the thing.
Trying to make your way across this thing that doesn't have all of its safety
rails yet and doesn't have... Cause again, it's a sea trial. We're gonna go
back and do the finish work. And it's like, "Ah, the USS Death Trap. So nice to
be out on the sea. AAAGH!" Slide into the back. But,
Len: So when... Disney builds their first two ships, right,
and the ships are registered in Panama?
Jim: I wanna say, Bahamas.
Len: Why weren't they registered in the United States?
Jim: Well, there's a lot of,
Len: I mean, there are no cruise ships that are registered
in the United States (???)?
Jim: No, no. It's just that between the financial advantages
and the merit time customs- speaking of which though, that's another thing that
made these, kind of makes these ships unique is the color scheme. I mean,
everybody knows about the Mickey, you know, how they used Mickey's colors to do
the boat. And what they ended up doing however was that they have to go head to
head... You can't just paint your boat any color. You actually have to go to US
Len: Guards, yeah.
Jim: Guard and there are merit time regulations. For
example, there's a reason they no longer paint boats black. Because when you're
driving your boat at night and another boat can't see you and drives into the side
of you it's like, again, Andrea Doria.
Len: Andrea Doria.
Jim: Yep. So, but,
Len: So that's why, so Disney I understand had to get
special permission to color their life boats. They're yellow, right?
Jim: Six months of dealing with the coast guard before.
Len: Normally they're orange so you can, for visibility.
Jim: Yep. So six months, Disney paid for the tests, and the
coast guard would throw a life boat out in,
Len: The Atlantic.
Jim: "Go find it." And it's like, "Okay. Well, yellow
works." So, but again, the weird thing of it is is that in... for Disney, this
is... it's not Mickey yellow. It's... I believe it's called Yellow 99. And in
fact the... What I love is the story about how they arrived at the Black...
Cause John Hench, who was the king of color for Disney at that point and really
wanted the Mickey color but they couldn't get a black that worked. And so, but
they were just starting to experiment with black blues to see whether or not
that would work and one day a secretary at Imagineering walks in. Her name is
Pam. And they just, into the meeting, delivering some memos and walks out and
Joe's like, "Stop!" And it's like, "Okay... what?" "Turn around." Pam is
wearing a blue, dark blue, verging on black pantsuit and John's like "I need your
Len: HR comes bursting into the room. And says "It's for
Jim: And seriously, John gets the pants, gets a color wheel,
and it's like, "That's it. That's it." And so that's actually... So, when you
go... When they're ordering up to prepay the boat, it's in honor of her. It's
Len: Is it really?
Jim: Yes. So,
Len: Pam's Pants Blue.
Jim: Pam's Pants Blue.
Len: Pam Blue. That's nice.
Jim: So, but yeah. They... But again, this is Disney.
There's a level of detail on these boats that just gets insane. I mean, whether
it's something for example, you and I the other night had a wonderful drink
up in Meridian.
Len: Yeah, the martini bar.
Jim: But the weird thing is that when you get in that room
and start talking with those guys, it's like, "Well first of all, this isn't a
martini bar. This is where we store the luggage." And in fact, if you look
around at all the chairs and such in that room, they have a strap down the
middle of them. So this is where old time suitcases had straps.
Jim: And again, because this is an old time room, they
bought these wonderful leather chairs that they went out and then distressed
because it had to be "old time."
Len: It's been on the ship for ages! Yeah. They do a really
good job with the details on those things.
Jim: Oh no no, absolutely. But at the same time, when you
look at things like what they did... because, again, it's a boat. And there are
safety regulations like you can't cook on this boat with gas. It's all
Jim: Yep. And again, because you have all these concerns
about fire at sea, so often what you think is wood- I mean, for example, when
you go into Remy, and those,
Len: The French restaurant, right?
Jim: Wonderful, beautiful, curving, stylized beams there.
It's like, "Not wood." Painted to look like wood,
Len: But not wood.
Jim: But not wood. I don't know. It's... I guess just to
sort of look ahead here, again, you have four ships that are going out with
ninety percent occupancy. And you ask Disney about the future, they hem, they
haw, but the reality is they have an open contract with the Germans for two
Len: With the Germans. Not with the Italians.
Jim: No. No no no. The interesting thing is that when it
comes to design, you know, for example everything in Palo's that is supposed to
be Italian was actually built by Italians. The rugs, the actual poles to open
the, where the wine is kept in Palo's. Built in Italy.
Jim: But it's like,
Len: We'll let the Germans built the ships.
Jim: Yeah. It's like,
Len: You guys are really good at art.
Jim: That's right. You can do the decorations. Let them
build the ships. But even the Germans... there was this unfortunate episode
where the Germans went home for the weekend and somebody left a valve open and
they came back on a Monday and the bottom deck of the ship had been flooded.
Len: Oopsie doodle.
Jim: So it's like "Aaagh,"
Len: They make accidents too.
Jim: You know, that's... overall, they were very very happy
with them and they'll continue on when they decide to continue on. But that's,
well, that... and then that opens a whole 'nother kettle of fish because it's
like right now... I mean, the number of boats that actually come here to Cast
Len: Three. Sometimes.
Jim: And if you in fact decide that you're going to add two
Len: We haven't talked about this yet, just from a rotation
perspective there could be conflicts.
Jim: Yep. So,
Len: Yeah, that would be terrible. All right, well, let's
wrap up this episode. In the next episode we'll talk about the ships in detail.
Let's do that. For Jim, this is Len. You've been listening to the Unofficial
Guide Disney Dish podcast with Jim Hill. We're broadcasting from Cast Away Cay.
We'll do one more episode (???). You can hear the water in the background. For
Jim, this is Len. Thanks for listening. Please rate us on Itunes and let us
know what else you'd like to hear next. And we'll see you on the next show.