Theme Parks & Themed Entertainment
“Shrek 4D”, “Mickey’s Philharmagic” and the post modern theme park — Part I
Guest columnist Seth Kubersky returns with a truly intriguing article about how these two new 3D films clearly illustrate Universal and Disney’s very different takes on how to entertain theme park guests.
“Welcome to the Happiest Totalitarian Kingdom on Earth”
(Ok, Maybe the Second Happiest)
Pop quiz — The above quote is:
a) An overhead sign that greets guests as they enter the pre-show of Universal Orlando’s “Shrek 4-D” attraction.
b) A very pointed (and very funny) slap at Disney.
c) An emblem of the most aggressively post-modern theme park attraction ever created.
The answer, of course, is d) All of the above.
“Shrek 4-D,” which opened this summer at Universal’s California and Florida parks, has earned rave reviews from guests and critics alike. Most of its success can traced to the same things that made the feature film so successful. Witty writing expertly delivered by talented voice actors. State-of-the-art CG animation that is both technically and artistically satisfying. The foresight and courage to identify an undercurrent of anti-Disney backlash in our culture and ride that to great comic effect. Add to the mix razor-sharp 3D projection and well-designed (if not groundbreaking) in-theater effects, and you have a top-flight new attraction.
But what does all that have to do with post-modernism? What about Shrek makes it an evolutionary philosophical leap beyond similar theme park attractions? And what the heck is post-modernism anyway?
Post-modernism is an artistic and philosophical movement that followed modernism. As self-evident as that definition seems, it’s about the only definition that all academics and theorists will agree on. The definition of post-modernism is notoriously slippery, and can vary greatly depending on how the term is applied and who is crafting the definition. For a brief primer on modernism and post-modernism, see http://nmc.loyola.edu/intro/postmod/pomopage-gu.htm or http://homepage.newschool.edu/~quigleyt/vcs/pomo.html.
Modernism is a movement that grew out of the European Enlightenment, emerging in the mid 18th century and reaching its peak in the first half of the 20th century. Modernism is rooted in the belief in science, rationality, and order. Continuity with the past, and the importance of constructing a consistent cultural narrative, are important. History is seen as the process through which man, as embodied by the rational individual, seeks to improve himself and his world through the efforts of his mind. The modern artist creates a frame for his work and seeks to maintain a consistent perspective within that frame. While the modern artist may combine elements of low and high culture in his work, the distinction between the two is always recognized and maintained.
Post-modernism emerged in the 1960s and 1970s as a reaction to events like Vietnam and Watergate. It represents the “death of history,” a rejection of the master cultural narrative that modernism sought to construct. Post-modernism is radically subjective and deconstructive, emphasizing the fragmented nature of culture and history. Unlike modernism, which is respectful and nostalgic towards the past, post-modernism is playful and irreverent, destroying context and juxtaposing disparate elements for ironic effect. Post-modern philosophy is suspicious of centralized authority, and favors the authenticity of the pre-modern and non-Western. The post-modern artist freely mixes high and low culture without distinction, and rejects the modernist ideal of “willing suspension of disbelief” in favor of self-awareness and breaking the fourth wall. Instead of a consistent perspective and coherent narrative, post-modernism presents a subversive pastiche of genres in which subtext is text and style is substance. The key words of post-modern thought are subversion, irony, and deconstruction.
It may be instructive to look first at a quintessentially Modern theme park attraction. “Mickey’s Philharmagic,” currently in previews at Walt Disney World’s Magic Kingdom, is just such an attraction. In this 3D film, a CGI-rendered Donald Duck attempts to conduct a symphony orchestra concert. Frustrated at the refusal of the enchanted instruments to follow his lead, Donald disregards Mickey’s warnings and activates the Sorcerer’s Apprentice hat, plunging him into a series of musical vignettes from classic Disney features. Donald tumbles through moments from “Beauty and the Beast,” “Fantasia,” “The Little Mermaid,” “The Lion King,” “Peter Pan,” and “Aladdin” before Mickey finally restores order. In the end, Donald receives his comeuppance and the audience hums their way to the gift shop.
“Mickey’s Philharmagic” is a delightful attraction that does many things right. Despite many people’s misgivings, the CGI Donald is a triumph, modeled and animated with real life and a classic sense of comic timing. Many of the other CGI characters are equally well done, particularly Lumierre and Zazu, though the humanoid characters like Ariel and Aladdin have a creepy Barbie-doll look. There is some wonderfully kid-pleasing use of 3D perspective, making this the first attraction since “Magic Journeys” to compel me to try to reach out and grab objects floating out of the screen. The in-theater effects, while nothing that hasn’t been done before, are used to excellent effect, especially the “cherry pie” scent and “popping champagne” air blasts. And the super-wide screen, though it sacrifices some brightness and clarity, makes this the most immersive 3D show since “Terminator 2: 3D.”
“Mickey’s Philharmagic” also has its flaws. The biggest is the barely themed queue and non-existent preshow, apparently victims of the belt-tightening familiar to most recent Disney attractions. The Fantasyland Theater has been home to many delightful preshows over the years, including Kodak’s “Making Memories” and the 3D Chip ‘N’ Dale cartoon, and it’s a shame this tradition couldn’t continue. Some of the choices of songs and characters are a bit odd. Lumiere stars in “Be Our Guest”, but Cogsworth and Mrs. Potts are MIA. Flounder makes a cameo during Ariel’s number, as does Zazu with Simba, but Sebastian and Nala are both absent. Without the Genie, “Part of Your World” nearly drags the show to a halt. And with the exception of brief interludes from “Fantasia” and “Peter Pan,” every “classic” represented is from the last 15 years. Most bizarrely, Mickey himself appears only briefly at the beginning and end, seen mostly from the rear at a distance, barely making a cameo in an attraction that bears his name.
While not an E-Ticket, “Mickey’s Philharmagic” is a very pleasant attraction that should succeed well with its target audience. Its fast pace, familiar characters, and classic music should give it more “re-ride” value than “It’s Tough to be a Bug”. But what makes it a Modernist attraction? For one, it presents a consistent creative perspective with no attempt to subvert the frame. Guests are audience members in a fantasy concert hall, as reinforced by the queue-line mural, character voice-overs in the pre-show holding area, and the design of the theater itself. A literal frame, a stage proscenium, establishes the perspective at the start of the show and is restored at the end. This reflects the modernist philosophy embodied by the plot. Mickey Mouse represents the forces of order and rationality (an ironic role for a character that began as an iconoclast) while Donald represents irrational chaos. At the end, Mickey returns to restore order and deliver comic justice to Donald for his disregard of the rules. Further, while the 3D and in-theater effects draw the audience into the frame, this is done to reinforce the suspension of disbelief, not to break it. Donald does not “wink” at the audience or make self-aware asides. Finally, the show presents a unified view of Disney history, creating a universe where characters from various Disney films interact but non-Disney culture and the real world does not intrude.
In this sense, the Magic Kindgdom (and all Disney parks) can be seen as essentially Modernist. Walt and his Imagineers used classic movie-making techniques to create an entire self-contained world. In each park, land, or attraction, the outside world is carefully screened out to create consistently immersive fantasy universe. Whether you are in a savage jungle, the long-gone American frontier, or a medieval fantasy village, every element is designed to create the illusion that you are in that time and place. Only the omnipresent un-ironic corporate commercialism (another hallmark of Modernism) reminds you that you are in a theme park. The text of the attractions themselves reinforces the Modernist agenda: the triumph of good over evil, respectful nostalgia for a golden past, and celebration of technology and progress.
By extension, Walt Disney was as much the protypical Modernist as the parks he created. He embodied the all-American ideals of hard work, technical innovation, and self-promotion. Walt felt a deep connection to his past (as represented by Main Street USA) and a faith in the institutions of America. And he made a clear distinction between his “low-culture” cartoons and the “high-culture” that he experimented with, and later famously apologized for, in “Fantasia.”
If Walt Disney and his creations represent the Modernist artistic philosophy in theme park entertainment, then can it be said that Universal represents the post-modern theme park? And how does Shrek represent the cutting edge of this movement? Come back for part two as we explore that question, and take a look at some truly subversive gags that you WON’T see in Shrek’s queue.
Theme Parks & Themed Entertainment
Disney and Macy’s 90-Year Thanksgiving Day Parade Partnership: From Mickey’s First Balloon to Minnie’s Big Debut
Now, folks, if you’re like me, Thanksgiving just wouldn’t be the same without a coffee, a cozy seat, and Macy’s Thanksgiving Day Parade on the TV. And if you’re really like me, you’re watching for one thing: Disney balloons floating down 34th Street. Ever wondered how Mickey, Donald, and soon Minnie Mouse found their way into this beloved New York tradition? Well, grab your popcorn because we’re diving into nearly 90 years of Disney’s partnership with Macy’s.
The Very First Parade and the Early Days of Balloons
The Macy’s Thanksgiving Day Parade goes way back to 1924, but if you can believe it, balloons weren’t part of the festivities until 1927. That first lineup included Felix the Cat, a dragon, and a toy soldier, all towering above the crowds. Back then, Macy’s had a pretty wild idea to end the parade: they would let the balloons drift off into the sky, free as birds. But this wasn’t just Macy’s feeling generous. Each balloon had a message attached, offering a $100 reward (about $1,800 in today’s dollars) for anyone who returned it to the flagship store on 34th Street.
And here’s where it gets interesting. This tradition carried on for a few years, right up until 1932, when Felix the Cat almost took down a plane flying over New York City! Imagine that—you’re flying into LaGuardia, and suddenly, there’s a 60-foot balloon drifting toward your wing. Needless to say, that was the end of Macy’s “fly away” stunt, and from then on, the balloons have stayed firmly grounded after the parade ends.
1934: Mickey Mouse Floats In, and Disney Joins the Parade
It was 1934 when Mickey Mouse finally made his grand debut in the Macy’s parade. Rumor has it Walt Disney himself collaborated with Macy’s on the design, and by today’s standards, that first Mickey balloon was a bit of a rough cut. This early Mickey had a hotdog-shaped body, and those oversized ears gave him a slightly lopsided look. But no one seemed to mind. Mickey was there, larger than life, floating down the streets of New York, and the crowd loved him.
Mickey wasn’t alone that year. He was joined by Pluto, Horace Horsecollar, and even the Big Bad Wolf and Practical Pig from The Three Little Pigs, making it a full Disney lineup for the first time. Back then, Disney wasn’t yet the entertainment powerhouse we know today, so for Walt, getting these characters in the parade meant making a deal. Macy’s required its star logo to be featured on each Disney balloon—a small concession that set the stage for Disney’s long-standing presence in the parade.
Duck Joins and Towers Over Mickey
A year later, in 1935, Macy’s introduced Donald Duck to the lineup, and here’s where things got interesting. Mickey may have been the first Disney character to float through the parade, but Donald made a huge splash—literally. His balloon was an enormous 60 feet tall and 65 feet long, towering over Mickey’s 40-foot frame. Donald quickly became a fan favorite, appearing in the lineup for several years before being retired.
Fast-forward a few decades, and Donald was back for a special appearance in 1984 to celebrate his 50th birthday. Macy’s dug the balloon out of storage, re-inflated it, and sent Donald down 34th Street once again, bringing a bit of nostalgia to the holiday crowd.
A Somber Parade in 2001
Now, one of my most memorable trips to the parade was in 2001, just weeks after the 9/11 attacks. Nancy and I, along with our friends, headed down to New York, and the mood was something I’ll never forget. We watched the start of the parade from Central Park West, but before that, we went to the Museum of Natural History the night before to see the balloons being inflated. They were covered in massive cargo nets, with sandbags holding them down. It’s surreal to see these enormous balloons anchored down before they’re set free.
That year, security was intense, with police lining the streets, and then-Mayor Rudy Giuliani rode on the Big Apple float to roaring applause. People cheered his name, waving and shouting as he passed. It felt like the entire city had turned out to show their resilience. Even amidst all the heightened security and tension, seeing those balloons—brought a bit of joy back to the city.
Balloon Prep: From New Jersey’s MetLife Stadium to California’s D23 Expo
Each year before the parade, Macy’s holds a rehearsal event known as Balloon Fest at MetLife Stadium in New Jersey. This is where handlers get their first crack at guiding the balloons, practicing with their parade masters, and learning the ropes—literally. It’s an entire production unto itself, with dozens of people rehearsing to make sure these enormous inflatables glide smoothly down the streets of New York on parade day.
In 2015, Macy’s took the balloon show on the road, bringing their Buzz Lightyear balloon out to California for the D23 Expo. I was lucky enough to be there, and watching Buzz get inflated piece by piece in the Anaheim Convention Center parking lot was something to behold. Each section was filled with helium in stages, and when they got around to Buzz’s lower half, well, there were more than a few gas-related jokes from the crowd.
These balloons seem to have a personality all their own, and seeing one like Buzz come to life up close—even outside of New York—had all the excitement and anticipation of the real deal.
Mickey’s Comeback as a Bandleader and Sailor Mickey
After a long hiatus, Mickey Mouse made his return to the Macy’s parade in 2000, this time sporting a new bandleader outfit. Nine years later, in 2009, Sailor Mickey joined the lineup, promoting Disney Cruise Line with a nautical twist. Over the past two decades, Disney has continued to enchant parade-goers with characters like Buzz Lightyear in 2008 and Olaf from Frozen in 2017. These balloons keep Disney’s iconic characters front and center, drawing in both longtime fans and new viewers.
But ever wonder what happens to the balloons after they reach the end of 34th Street? They don’t just disappear. Each balloon is carefully deflated, rolled up like a massive piece of laundry, and packed into storage bins. From there, they’re carted back through the Lincoln Tunnel to Macy’s Parade Studio in New Jersey, where they await their next flight.
Macy’s Disney Celebration at Hollywood Studios
In 1992, Macy’s took the spirit of the parade down to Disney-MGM Studios in Orlando. After that year’s parade, several balloons—including Santa Goofy, Kermit the Frog, and Betty Boop—were transported to Hollywood Studios, re-inflated, and anchored along New York Street as part of a holiday display. Visitors could walk through this “Macy’s New York Christmas” setup and see the balloons up close, right in the middle of the park. While this display only ran for one season, it paved the way for the Osborne Family Spectacle of Dancing Lights, which became a holiday staple at the park for years to come.
Minnie Mouse’s Long-Awaited Debut in 2024
This year, Minnie Mouse will finally join the parade, making her long-overdue debut. Macy’s is rolling out the red carpet for Minnie’s arrival with special pop-up shops across the country, where fans can find exclusive Minnie ears, blown-glass ornaments, T-shirts, and more to celebrate her first appearance in the Thanksgiving Day Parade.
For those lucky enough to catch the parade this year, you’ll see Minnie take her first float down 34th Street, decked out in her iconic red bow and polka-dot dress. Macy’s and Disney are also unveiling a new Disney Cruise Line float honoring all eight ships, including the latest, the Disney Treasure.
As always, I’ll be watching from my favorite chair, coffee in hand, as Minnie makes her grand entrance. The 98th annual Macy’s Thanksgiving Day Parade airs live on NBC, and it’s a tradition you won’t want to miss—whether you’re on 34th Street or tuning in from home.
Theme Parks & Themed Entertainment
Disney’s Forgotten Halloween Event: The Original Little Monsters on Main Street
When most Disney fans think of Halloween in the parks, they immediately picture Mickey’s Not-So-Scary Halloween Party at Walt Disney World or the Oogie Boogie Bash at Disneyland Resort. But before those events took over as the must-attend spooky celebrations, there was a little-known event at Disneyland called Little Monsters on Main Street. And its origins? Well, they go all the way back to the 1980s, during a time when America was gripped by fear—the Satanic Panic.
You see, back in the mid-1980s, parents were terrified that Halloween had become dangerous. Urban legends about drug-laced candy or razor blades hidden in apples were widespread, and many parents felt they couldn’t let their kids out of sight for even a moment. Halloween, which was once a carefree evening of trick-or-treating in the neighborhood, had suddenly become a night filled with anxiety.
This is where Disneyland’s Little Monsters on Main Street came in.
The Origins of Little Monsters on Main Street
Back in 1989, the Disneyland Community Action Team—later known as the VoluntEARS—decided to create a safe, nostalgic Halloween experience for Cast Members and their families. Many schools in the Anaheim area were struggling to provide basic school supplies to students, and the VoluntEARS saw an opportunity to combine a safe Halloween with a charitable cause. Thus, Little Monsters on Main Street was born.
This event was not open to the general public. Only Disneyland Cast Members could purchase tickets, which were initially priced at just $5 each. Cast Members could bring their kids—but only as many as were listed as dependents with HR. And even then, the park put a cap on attendance: the first event was limited to just 1,000 children.
A Unique Halloween Experience
Little Monsters on Main Street wasn’t just another Halloween party. It was designed to give kids a safe, fun environment to enjoy trick-or-treating, much like the good old days. On Halloween night in 1989, kids in costume wandered through Disneyland with their pillowcases, visiting 20 different trick-or-treat stations. They also had the chance to ride a few of their favorite Fantasyland attractions, all after the park had closed to the general public.
The event was run entirely by the VoluntEARS—about 200 of them—who built and set up all the trick-or-treat stations themselves. They arrived at Disneyland before the park closed and, as soon as the last guest exited, they began setting up stations across Main Street, Adventureland, Frontierland, Fantasyland, and Tomorrowland. The event ran from 7:30 to 9:30 p.m., and by the time the last pillowcase-wielding kid left, the VoluntEARS cleaned everything up, making sure the park was ready for the next day’s operations.
It wasn’t just candy and rides, though. The event featured unique entertainment, like a Masquerade Parade down Main Street, U.S.A., where kids could show off their costumes. And get this—Disneyland even rigged up a Cast Member dressed as a witch to fly from the top of the Matterhorn to Frontierland on the same wire that Tinker Bell uses during the fireworks. Talk about a magical Halloween experience!
The Haunted Mansion “Tip-Toe” Tour
Perhaps one of the most memorable parts of Little Monsters on Main Street was the special “tip-toe tour” of the Haunted Mansion. Now, Disneyland’s Haunted Mansion can be a pretty scary attraction for younger kids, so during this event, Disney left the doors to the Stretching Room and Portrait Gallery wide open. This allowed kids to walk through and peek at the Haunted Mansion’s spooky interiors without actually having to board the Doom Buggies. For those brave enough to ride, they could, of course, take the full trip through the Haunted Mansion—or they could take the “chicken exit” and leave, no harm done.
Growing Success and a Bigger Event
Thanks to the event’s early success, Little Monsters on Main Street grew in size. By 1991, the attendance cap had been raised to 2,000 kids, and Disneyland added more activities like magic shows and hayrides. They also extended the event’s hours, allowing kids to enjoy the festivities until 10:30 p.m.
In 2002, the event moved over to Disney California Adventure, where it could accommodate even more kids—up to 5,000 in its later years. The name was also shortened to just Little Monsters, since it was no longer held on Main Street. This safe, family-friendly Halloween event continued for several more years, with the last mention of Little Monsters appearing in the Disneyland employee newsletter in 2008. Though some Cast Members recall the event continuing until 2012, it eventually made way for Disney’s more public-facing Halloween events.
From Little Monsters to Mickey’s Not-So-Scary and Oogie Boogie Bash
Starting in the early 2000s, Disney began realizing the potential of Halloween-themed after-hours events for the general public. These early versions of Mickey’s Halloween Party and Mickey’s Halloween Treat eventually evolved into today’s Mickey’s Not-So-Scary Halloween Party and Oogie Boogie Bash. Unfortunately, this also marked the end of the intimate, Cast Member-exclusive Little Monsters event, but it paved the way for the large-scale Halloween celebrations we know and love today.
While it’s bittersweet to see Little Monsters on Main Street fade into Disney history, its legacy lives on through these modern Halloween parties. And even though Cast Members now receive discounted tickets to Mickey’s Not-So-Scary and Oogie Boogie Bash, the special charm of an event created specifically for Disney’s employees and their families remains something worth remembering.
The Merch: A Piece of Little Monsters History
For Disney collectors, the exclusive merchandise created for Little Monsters on Main Street is still out there. You can find pins, name tags, and themed pillowcases on sites like eBay. One of the coolest collectibles is a 1997 cloisonné pin set featuring Huey, Dewey, and Louie dressed as characters from Hercules. Other sets paid tribute to the Main Street Electrical Parade and Pocahontas, while the pillowcases were uniquely designed for each year of the event.
While Little Monsters on Main Street may be gone, it’s a fascinating piece of Disneyland history that played a huge role in shaping the Halloween celebrations we enjoy at Disney parks today.
Want to hear more behind-the-scenes stories like this? Be sure to check out I Want That Too, where Lauren and I dive deep into the history behind Disney’s most beloved attractions, events, and of course, merchandise!
Theme Parks & Themed Entertainment
The Story of Mickey’s Not-So-Scary Halloween Party: From One Night to a Halloween Family Tradition
The spooky season is already in full swing at Disney parks on both coasts. On August 9th, the first of 38 Mickey’s Not-So-Scary Halloween Party (MNSSHP) nights for 2024 kicked off at Florida’s Magic Kingdom. Meanwhile, over at Disney California Adventure, the Oogie Boogie Bash began on August 23rd and is completely sold out across its 27 dates this year.
Looking back, it’s incredible to think about how these Halloween-themed events have grown. But for Disney, the idea of charging guests for Halloween fun wasn’t always a given. In fact, when the very first Mickey’s Not-So-Scary Halloween Party debuted on October 31, 1995, it was a modest one-night-only affair. Compare that to the near month-long festivities we see today, and it’s clear that Disney’s approach to Halloween has evolved considerably.
A Not-So-Scary Beginning
I was fortunate enough to attend that very first MNSSHP back in 1995, along with my then 18-month-old daughter Alice and her mom, Michelle. Tickets were a mere $16.95 (I know, can you imagine?), and we pushed Alice around in her sturdy Emmaljunga stroller—Swedish-built and about the size of a small car. Cast Members, charmed by her cuteness, absolutely loaded us up with candy. By the end of the night, we had about 30 pounds of fun-sized candy bars, making that push up to the monorail a bit more challenging.
This Halloween event was Disney’s response to the growing popularity of Universal Studios Florida’s own Halloween hard ticket event, which started in 1991 as “Fright Nights” before being rebranded as “Halloween Horror Nights” the following year. Universal’s gamble on a horror-themed experience helped salvage what had been a shaky opening for their park, and by 1993, Halloween Horror Nights was a seven-night event, with ticket prices climbing as high as $35. Universal had stumbled upon a goldmine, and Disney took notice.
A Different Approach
Now, here’s where Disney’s unique strategy comes into play. While Universal embraced the gory, scare-filled world of horror, Disney knew that wasn’t their brand. Instead of competing directly with blood and jump-scares, Disney leaned into what they did best: creating magical, family-friendly experiences.
Thus, Mickey’s Not-So-Scary Halloween Party was born. The focus was on fun and whimsy, not fear. Families could bring their small children without worrying about them being terrified by a chainsaw-wielding maniac around the next corner. This event wasn’t just a Halloween party—it was an extension of the Disney magic that guests had come to expect from the parks.
Disney had some experience with seasonal after-hours events, most notably Mickey’s Very Merry Christmas Party, which had started in 1983. But the Halloween party was different, as the Magic Kingdom wasn’t yet decked out in Halloween decor the way it is today. Disney had to create a spooky (but not too spooky) atmosphere using temporary props, fog machines, and, of course, lots of candy.
A key addition to that first event? The debut of the Headless Horseman, who made his eerie appearance in Liberty Square, riding a massive black Percheron. It wasn’t as elaborate as the Boo-to-You Parade we see today, but it marked the beginning of a beloved Disney Halloween tradition.
A Modest Start but a Big Future
That first MNSSHP in 1995 was seen as a trial run. As Disney World spokesman Greg Albrecht told the Orlando Sentinel, “If it’s successful, we’ll do it again.” And while attendance was sparse that night, there was clearly potential. By 1997, the event expanded to two nights, and by 1999, Mickey’s Not-So-Scary Halloween Party had grown into a multi-night celebration with a full-fledged parade. Today, in 2024, it’s a staple of the fall season at Walt Disney World, offering 38 nights of trick-or-treating, character meet-and-greets, and special entertainment.
Universal’s Influence
It’s interesting to reflect on how Disney’s Halloween event might never have existed without the competition from Universal. Just as “The Wizarding World of Harry Potter” forced Disney to step up their game with “Star Wars: Galaxy’s Edge,” Universal’s success with Halloween Horror Nights likely spurred Disney into action with MNSSHP. The friendly rivalry between the two parks has continually pushed both to offer more to their guests, and we’re all better off because of it.
So the next time you find yourself trick-or-treating through the Magic Kingdom, watching the Headless Horseman gallop by, or marveling at the seasonal fireworks, take a moment to appreciate how this delightful tradition came to be—all thanks to a little competition and Disney’s commitment to creating not-so-scary magic.
For more Disney history and behind-the-scenes stories, check out the latest episodes of the I Want That Too podcast on the Jim Hill Media network.
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